Rioter Comments
Husy15 (OCE)
: I might have really explained myself and the situation badly i guess, i was trying to make an analogy to explain what i meant. However i do disagree with your first point. As someone who has played a lot of jungle myself, i know the first rule of ganking... is to make sure your laner is in with you.. unless you can guarantee a solo-kill in my situation, as camille top, i know i can farm easily, gain my health back with W(Which also pokes), and stay safe without dying with my hookshot. i wasn't at risk of dying, and recalling 40seconds before my TP came back up, would have been a little bad in the situation. nonetheless, i saw the situation and retreat pinged knowing the gank would go badly.. (Me knowing the strength of my lane opponent at that time, knowing he could kill us easily) however none of that really matters, it was just a back-drop setting of the events that took place. which was toxic and very much hidden under Riots current rule system... It is VERY easy to make one of your own teammates behind in a game.. it's very easy to ruin their entire lane, jungle, or just outright constantly get them killed. take smite mid, smite ur junglers first buff, and then proceed to steal his jungle... i guarentee you he will be useless. and with the current rule system.... The person being toxic in reality, is not.. because their score is fine.. while the poor jungler that went 2-8, had 5 levels down, and didnt secure a single buff for himself... is seen as INTing.. And yes, this is "minor" toxicity at most... however it's very prevalent in the game... and not just at my MMR, i often play against/with plats/diamonds (especially last season), and it's still very prevalent.. People who just don't care about making the game worse for other people, who go out of their way to ruin their experience, yet nothing is done? What i tried to convey with my post (However realized i failed), is that work-arounds to the current rule system are very easy to find, very prevalent in the current game, and honestly just make everyone's experience so much worse. With at least acknowledging some of this toxicity, Riot may be able to reduce it, however they don't recognize it at all, and that's where my issue lies. "(NOONE WILL EVER GET BANNED FOR THIS)" This was the issue i have. The "get over it and start another game" Mentality, as i said in my Original post, this isn't about me not getting over a single game. this is about what these games do to the players: -You tilt, regardless of how hard u try not to, your performance will be worse. As for me, as i stated above, whenever something annoys/tilts me in a game, i usually take a break (or atleast from ranked, i usually just ARAM), either for an hour, or a day, maybe a few days. For multiple reasons, i know that me playing ranked after that won't do me any good. It isn't a good experience, not for me, not and not for the majority of players... so many people have an issue with these small bits of toxicity, yet nothing is being done or said.
Thankfully i can speak as a jungle main myself which should help me with getting your perspective abit I mean i dunno if that's the first rule of ganking but sure okay I mean clearly it was a bad gank, if he had done these types of ganks over and over you might have an issue. But in all honesty if u were oom and he was low u should of just let him die. You can't control others bad play and considering you knew full well it was gonna be a fail makes it worse. And yeah that example you gave about the smite mid is legitimate of course that would likely set u back 10 mins depending on the type of jungler your playing and well maybe it might be seen as a poor game but probably not inting because its highly unlike that situation would happen every game. And i mean they hardly have a system to get hardcore inters banned let alone any kind of behaviour like this and i agree id like to see something happen as well but its a long long way off. The only reason i have that mentality because i've been in your position but i have learnt to accept that f all will be done and its out of my control entirely. Honestly the best thing u can do is mute all can play the game to the best of your ability.. its unfortunate but nothing is going to change. You could soft int for the rest of your life and be fine. gl.
Husy15 (OCE)
: An Open Letter to Riot
> Yes, this will finally be an example from a recent game: > -greedy khazix jungle > -me as camille top > > I wanted to play safe, retreat pinged him on his attempt to gank, regardless he ganked, and we both died. (i was low, and he was oom). > > he then decided that my lane was up for grabs, constantly coming top and taking all my farm, and every time i was close to getting a kill, he would flash or purposefully jump in to steal it... > > Camille is a mid-lategame champion, with her early-game being weak.. taking a LOT of gold to actually become decent/strong.. > > this just makes your job 100x harder... 40farm down, 0 kills, you haven't finished your first item, while the jungler is 10-3 with 30 more farm than you.. > > And even if you win the game... who is seen as the bad player? the person who purposefully ruined the lane? no? hes 10-3 with 200farm... the camille dealing 0 damage and not being tanky... while not dying.. is bad. I'm sorry but this is one of the most dumbest things i have read on these forums ... Yeah you might of wanted to "play safe" that doesn't mean you are like a god in game and everyone should listen to what you want in ranked or not.. Yeah granted it sounds like a bad time to gank your lane but if your that low your dying 2v1 you probably should of recalled sooner obviously a few things depend on this like if you're last hitting under tower for an item or u don't wanna miss a big wave etc. Also at the end of the day do u really care who considers you a good and bad player in 1 solo q game? if you really are that good you're gonna win most of your games and your stats will say so, so why bother about what a couple of randoms say particularly if you win the game... Take the lp and move on. I mean this is minor toxicity at the very most you can certainly work around.. its not like the dude was inting or even flaming in chat. You can usually just push the side lanes to gain your cs back and yeah.. I dunno it just comes across as you would be 10/10 triggered if the jungler pushed the wave to tower after ganking and killer enemy laner. And in regards to your spam emote section and the penta kill yeah that's pretty bm but on the other hand a guy got a penta so hopefully u pick up the win take the lp and u move on. (NO ONE WILL EVER GET BANNED FOR THIS) But yeah i feel you. but there are definitely work arounds.. just be grateful no one is running it down mid 10 times in ur game
Arkangyle (OCE)
: AFKers in Ranked
> [{quoted}](name=Arkangyle,realm=OCE,application-id=T8eq2lFQ,discussion-id=6qUxQeGB,comment-id=,timestamp=2018-03-14T10:31:50.759+0000) > > So I'm writing this post at the recommendation of a Rioter I spoke to recently. Long post incoming. > > We all know how this feels - someone in your ranked game goes AFK, and despite you having a decent lead you just can't close it out 4v5. Maybe your team gives up, or maybe the enemy team just out rotates and out teamfights you once they realise your fed adc isn't here anymore. But either way you end up losing (usually), and the frustration at your missing team mate is exacerbated by the face you still lose the full amount of LP. > > Now this isn't a post to flame Riot or any of the systems they have in place. Leaverbuster is good for making sure the person who AFK'd (regardless of their reasoning) doesn't get off scot-free. And the remake system has been good for helping you avoid the 4v5 if someone doesn't connect. I honestly think Riot's trying to make things better for people in these situations. > > But the system is falling short in that the people left behind still get penalised. > > One possible solution I can see is introducing a system that reduces the LP loss for people left behind when a team mate AFKs. The systems are already in place to recognise when it happens - players who AFK don't receive experience or LP and can't get honored. So the client knows when it happens - and I'd like to see it brought in that when the system does notice it, the LP losses are reduced. Not removed entirely - otherwise there's a window for it to be abused, but even if it's a 25-50% reduction in your LP losses, I think it would be less of an issue. > > That way there's still an incentive to keep playing and keep trying to win (obviously winning > losing), but if it proves ultimately unsuccessful, it's less of a case of innocent players being punished for someone else's actions. > > My response when I brought this up with a Rioter was to "open a topic on the matter on the board since it would be beneficial to the player base, and deserves to be discussed on it". So here we are. > > I'd welcome any and all opinions on the matter. > > glhf Tbh, it's not the LP that really worries me personally, but id like more satisfaction when i report someone.. maybe some feedback other than just the instant feedback or whatever... because u type in the box they disconnected and we lost because of it, its like no one really cares and you will never know what happens to the player in question. Sure losing 15 lp over 20 would be nice but we already have promo free wins etc... back in the day u got absolutely 0 so i think its easier to climb now than ever (arguably i guess) so yeah. that's another option.
Ingénue (OCE)
: Hey :) _Interesting points you have brought up and thank you so much for putting it into a positive discussion format! _ > 1st) I was diamond back in S3 but haven't played much since and this season I've been climbing from bronze and am currently in mid gold. There is without a doubt reportable/bannable behaviour in 90% of games. 90%!! This is a major issue when your system devalues people who are constantly reporting others. The system NEEDS to only devalue reports when they are actually shown to be false not just when they don't pass punishment, if there is reportable behaviour in 90% of games, and someone reports 90% of the time they are actually doing the work you want them to do and yet you're devaluing their input. [Good thing is that reporting others (even if you report them a lot) doesn't actually devalue your report](https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/player-behavior-moderation/9VrUtrJo-being-solo-and-having-a-team-report?comment=00000000000200000000000000000000000000000000). Only one report is needed to trigger a review, and if someone is reported the game will be reviewed. Since IFS was implemented a few years ago it has grown pretty significantly in being able to detect verbal toxicity (which is pretty great, seeing as this is a pretty big ongoing problem). Unfortunately it is still quite crappy when it comes to behavioral violations since those are are harder to detect for the system, and easier to conceal for the offending player. With the "one report needed" thing, we can hope it continues to get better at detection and that we will see the instance of "reportable/bannable" behavior down. > 2nd) It's very RNG and the community is so filled with toxicity that you can't actually trust majority voting. ... reporter has had an unrelated series of bad games. Once again, report weight is no longer a thing so you need not worry about situations like this. > 1) Mute function - People don't use it nearly enough. Why? Because the person yelling at them, is still yelling at them, just because they can't read it doesn't mean it's not happening and if you want to win the game, you need all your team mates to be focused on the game. Suggestion: when someone mutes a player, it should come up on the players screen saying "X has muted you". Very simple feature but it will give the person muting a small sense of pleasure (encouraging them to use it) and it will undoubtably confirm for the aggressor that no one is seeing their spam (encouraging them to stop flaming and focus on the game) this is very important because at the moment the aggressor would just continue to flame into deaf ears. Muting is interesting. Like you said, even after you mute someone the damage has been done and the flamer is still going to continue on. With your suggestion though, my experience has been that even after someone mutes someone in my game and tells them so, the flamer continues to berate them even if it does fall on deaf ears (and thus continues to spend more concentration on the chat instead of the game). If it was implemented, a little message that is official and does confirm that the person has been muted it *might* help, although I am skeptical. I agree with a post someone made a while ago about a pop-up at the end of game reminding you to report the players that you muted. Too often we mute someone because of their flame and forget about it, often leading to players such as this not getting punished. After all, we don't report ♥ ♥ ♥ ♥ , the players wont get punished and the system will not learn. > 2) Bans vs chat restriction - Bans are brutal, chat restriction is annoying but doesn't ruin someones day or even week, infact being chat restricted is almost a relief. I don't think that anything said in game should be a bannable offense, after all, that's what the mute function and adult language filters are for. If someone is still playing the game but just being an ass to other players about it, prevent them from typing. Toxicity comes from frustration- bans cause more frustration, chat bans don't so use them much more. At the moment the punishment comes in 4 steps. Three chances to realize your behavior is unacceptable and that you need to stop. * First Offense: 10 Game Chat Restriction * Second Offense: 25 Game Chat Restriction * Third Offense: Two Week Suspension * Fourth Offense: Permanent Suspension If you haven't worked out why your behavior is not ok after two warnings, it means that another chat restriction probably isn't going to help. At all points of the punishment system players are encouraged to speak to a support agent to discuss the behavior that is getting them in trouble so that they may learn from their mistakes and continue forwards a punishment-free player. Obviously you wont be getting chat banned if you are pulling off behavioural toxicity such as inting, you will start at the two week ban. If your verbal toxicity is also pretty hardcore (homophobia, racism, sexism, encouraging self harm) then you will also start on the two week ban tier because you should be smart enough to know that that kind of shit is never ok. I disagree with you saying that nothing you say in game should be bannable. I absolutely think that people that are dumb enough to use slurs and tell people to kill themselves should be banned. Words like that have so much power, and sometimes people don't really understand the impact that these kinds of words can have on people. I have few friends that get upset about some of the homophobic slurs after their families used them as they were thrown out of the house and disowned. Can you imagine how shitty it would be to have those memories dredged up because you failed a gank? I also believe that people who are constantly spurting low grade toxicity towards their teammates should also have to be held accountable for their actions. Telling your support they are trash and should uninstall isn't going to help them play better and is a pretty dick move. So is dwelling on the mistakes of others, especially when you are gonna be making a fuck tonne yourself. Of course teammates can mute, but like I said earlier, [at that point the damage is done](https://boards.oce.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/player-behaviour/0gFPUhA8-second-thread-blahblahblahblahblah?comment=00010001000000000000). You may have ruined the one game a day that a person had time for. They might be using video games as an escape from some real life troubles and aren't in a good headspace. You probably would have tilted them and made them hyper aware of their every movement and as a result their play becomes worse. > 3) The climb... - Climbing in leagues is like no other game I've played... It's incredibly rough. Not only are you 1 player of 5 on a team meaning your impact on the game is limited, your MMR is SO slugish. You could play like a god and win 10 games in a row and only move up 1 division, this is actually insane. I travel to the EU a lot and so I have an account there as well and unsurprisingly it is VERY different but beyond all the community differences is an actual difference in leagues - Having climbed through divisions into plat on my EU account I could see very clearly the changes in the quality of players as I progressed. However in OCE there were people I vs'd in bronze equally skilled with people I vs in gold right now, the differences are very small. I have heard quite a few people say that in bronze-gold is pretty much the same but with slightly increasing mechanics, plat is where a little bit of macro comes in and that the jump from D4/5 to D3+ is bigger than the jump from bronze to plat. It's basically the nature of the server. You will also find that a good portion of players in your games will be lagging due to the quality of internet in the countries that OCE encompasses, and this has a pretty big impact on how well players will be playing. You could play like a god in 10 games and win every one and move up one division, but it could just be a fluke. It's such a small sample size. If you continue playing like a god, then yes, your MMR will accelerate and you will start skipping 1-2 divisions at a time. Sometimes you can even skip promos. Your MMR has to be decent to begin with, otherwise it can and will take a while for it to get to that point. It's better to keep the climb slow and steady though, or you will find things similar to what happened after ardent last season. People who play champs strong in that meta were gaining so much rank. Once the ardent boom was over, they struggled to keep their new ranks and slid their way back down. A good player should be able to adjust and climb steadily so they are able to consistently maintain their rank. The current MMR system allows this. It also allows smurfs to easily rise back to a suitable rank for them, after all, if you know how to climb it isn't that hard. >Didn't even mention earlier but there needs to be use of actual ingame performance in LP awarded calculation because people win the lottery every day and that's 1 in millions, having a system purely built on law of averages creates frustration via luck. In a perfect world there would be a panel of judges watching every player in every game and awarding points based on performance not result, obviously that's impossible but Riot should be pushing to have as much performance weight over result as feasible People have suggested getting LP based on the game grading system time and time again, but thats pretty flawed. You can sit in a side lane and just farm and not help your team and get a good score. Likewise, you can use yourself as bait (like I had a 3/16 teemo jungle do) and allow your team to push objectives on the other side of the map. There are far too many variables for something like that to work.
I feel you tbh.. i remember playing back on NA (from early season 2 where dodge on ninja tabi was still a thing until the oce server came out) and i really don't remember the toxicity on NA being as bad.. maybe my memory fails me and yeah i understand most people on OCE came from NA to begin with.. I think warnings need to come back into the system... Say the system notices your stats being quite low K/D/A, CS, level etc, you should get a warning saying along the lines of we have noticed poor play etc etc but i can see why people would say that could be demoralizing for people who are just really bad at the game but im talking after 4/5 games and a kda of like 2/10 something like this... Would be a lot quicker than the system we have now.. Back when i was on NA i got banned for a week for simply being bad... literally wasn't inting in the games and the comment from the person who reported me said "bad kda and bad cs as caitlyn adc) i think i went 2/7 something roughly and there was two examples of me being bad i'm not sure over how long these games were.. but i was actually shocked because i remembered those games and i was trying in them... I think that riot should look at how quickly you die to take into account a ban... for example they see a point where u die at 5 mins and 5:35 u are dead again, i would think that's a good sign of inting.. along with a few other aspects we have now to result in a quicker ban. Getting banned for verbal abuse imo is pretty good the way it is... works a lot better than when people troll in game that's for sure.
: I think sometimes they forget its a COMPETITIVE game esp in Ranked. I ve had a lot of people say its just ranked, when Zoe came out I had people pick Zoe and feed mid lane. it just has no logic to me what so ever my logic would so go practice on bots or even just in norms not in ranked. but again 99 percent of the worlds population is dumb as.
Comes back to an issue a lot of people have been complaining about recently on the forums... Riot does not have a system in place to ban people quick enough for trolling and inting, abuse in chat? don't worry you will be permmed before you know it.. But you could legit go 1/10 in like 20 plus ranked games in a row with you getting reported every game before riot acts on said person.. even then probably not if they stop.
Ninox (OCE)
: I felt that Periscope and the other threads you have commented in and I have replied to would have more than adequately explained how the system functions and it's shortcomings. I didn't think it necessary to repeat myself to you. Gameplay offences take longer to punish for the automated system because it has to be confident that a player is actually intentionally feeding. An intent feeder can have identical stats, items and deaths to a player who is just bad and has no concept of positioning/map awareness/how to play from behind etc etc, whereas chat is more often than not a lot less ambiguous. It's not ideal, it's not what anyone wants, but it is what it is. As for your IFS popup. I don't know, the only thing I can assume is that you reported multiple people, maybe from a previous game You won't get the notification while you're in game, so if you jumped straight into a second game, the popup could well have been for the first one. I've never seen or heard of one popping up when it shouldn't, quite the opposite in fact, so unless it's an isolated bug, or a punishment that was issued and then appealed and revoked (which I doubt was the case here) the popup had to have been for someone else.
> [{quoted}](name=Seras Dragon,realm=OCE,application-id=T8eq2lFQ,discussion-id=Gv180dlP,comment-id=00020001000000000001,timestamp=2018-03-12T01:29:24.118+0000) > > I felt that Periscope and the other threads you have commented in and I have replied to would have more than adequately explained how the system functions and it's shortcomings. I didn't think it necessary to repeat myself to you. > > Gameplay offences take longer to punish for the automated system because it has to be confident that a player is actually intentionally feeding. An intent feeder can have identical stats, items and deaths to a player who is just bad and has no concept of positioning/map awareness/how to play from behind etc etc, whereas chat is more often than not a lot less ambiguous. It's not ideal, it's not what anyone wants, but it is what it is. > > As for your IFS popup. I don't know, the only thing I can assume is that you reported multiple people, maybe from a previous game You won't get the notification while you're in game, so if you jumped straight into a second game, the popup could well have been for the first one. > > I've never seen or heard of one popping up when it shouldn't, quite the opposite in fact, so unless it's an isolated bug, or a punishment that was issued and then appealed and revoked (which I doubt was the case here) the popup had to have been for someone else. I honestly don't remember the last time i reported someone before this said person... usually when i report someone for abuse in chat without fail within 15 mins of the report i get an instant feedback... we all agreed that we would report her and 10 mins later i got a report and i believe it was worded a little bit differently than the one u get when someone is abusive... might be incorrect but still, that's a very odd coincidence if i just happened to get this report after playing this particular game...
: > [{quoted}](name=LegendOfswords,realm=OCE,application-id=T8eq2lFQ,discussion-id=Gv180dlP,comment-id=0002000100000000,timestamp=2018-03-11T14:27:38.347+0000) > > Oh now your here... Wanna tell me why the ban system is broken then? she should of been banned for 2 weeks.. 1. Seras is not a rioter, therefore can't give you the rundown 2. As has already been said, Riot cares only about Toxic players, Every else doesn't matter to them 3. Who gives a shit if they int, get over it and play another game, i get inters 1 in 4ish games, and i still have a 54% WR, you probably have something similar, you'll climb eventually regardless of Inters
> [{quoted}](name=DarkShade918,realm=OCE,application-id=T8eq2lFQ,discussion-id=Gv180dlP,comment-id=00020001000000000000,timestamp=2018-03-11T22:38:03.620+0000) > > 1. Seras is not a rioter, therefore can't give you the rundown > 2. As has already been said, Riot cares only about Toxic players, Every else doesn't matter to them > 3. Who gives a shit if they int, get over it and play another game, i get inters 1 in 4ish games, and i still have a 54% WR, you probably have something similar, you'll climb eventually regardless of Inters Seras seems to respond to everything as if he is a rioter and defends them at every turn basically hence me saying that.. and he can usually seem to give the run down on everything else... and also not everyone has 12 hours a day to just play another game... its a pain in the arse to spend 40 odd mins in a game you're never going to win...
Ninox (OCE)
: Support won't give you any info about someone else's account (privacy and all that) so you'll just get a generic "thanks for your report, please use post game reporting where possible" type reply. Expect any more than that and I'm afraid you'll be disappointed.
> [{quoted}](name=Seras Dragon,realm=OCE,application-id=T8eq2lFQ,discussion-id=Gv180dlP,comment-id=000200010000,timestamp=2018-03-11T11:23:05.952+0000) > > Support won't give you any info about someone else's account (privacy and all that) so you'll just get a generic "thanks for your report, please use post game reporting where possible" type reply. Expect any more than that and I'm afraid you'll be disappointed. Oh now your here... Wanna tell me why the ban system is broken then? she should of been banned for 2 weeks..
yCarr (OCE)
: She probably got a message saying "Good job on playing your best game, now reminder that everyone doesn't always play their best game we don't care about what kda you have as long as you have fun in game thats is all that matters!!!! fuck all these other people trying to climb the ranks , you can go jana jungle all you want but if your not toxic then your alright with riot!!!
yeah well ive submitted a ticket to riot and ill see wtf they have to say
: Ha the funny thing is that you think Riot cares about people inting.
I don't really but if i get an instant feedback for one i expect some results..
: What is the punishment for inting??????
Like i dunno.... its clear that the instant feedback was for her, when people actually do get punished for "inting" nothing happens... cool system.
: Hmm. Well I'm just going off of your information you're telling me and the match history. It's not really 100% clear that she was inting, but I'd agree from looking at the kill map that she more than likely appeared to be intentionally feeding. She's building appropriately. But I guess what catches my eye is that her deaths in the top and bottom lane are clustered together very closely in time, and near the enemy towers.
> [{quoted}](name=Periscope,realm=NA,application-id=T8eq2lFQ,discussion-id=Gv180dlP,comment-id=000000000000,timestamp=2018-03-09T09:09:00.617+0000) > > Hmm. Well I'm just going off of your information you're telling me and the match history. It's not really 100% clear that she was inting, but I'd agree from looking at the kill map that she more than likely appeared to be intentionally feeding. She's building appropriately. But I guess what catches my eye is that her deaths in the top and bottom lane are clustered together very closely in time, and near the enemy towers. Yeah she ran it down bot a few times. and we all reported and got the instant feedback that a punishment took place. But shes still playing??
: If they were punished, then they typically get a 2-week ban for their first offense. Just because you got feedback doesn't mean that particular person was punished.
> [{quoted}](name=Periscope,realm=NA,application-id=T8eq2lFQ,discussion-id=Gv180dlP,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2018-03-09T08:45:49.679+0000) > > If they were punished, then they typically get a 2-week ban for their first offense. > > Just because you got feedback doesn't mean that particular person was punished. Really dude? i have not reported anyone for like 3 days and we all agreed to report her and 10 mins after game i got an instant feedback, and it was for inting because the writing was different than a toxic instant feedback... just slightly though.. the system is faulty.
Rioter Comments
: You dont have to swear to be toxic. The attitude matters too
> [{quoted}](name=The Cream Reaper,realm=EUNE,application-id=T8eq2lFQ,discussion-id=kQcv9KVW,comment-id=000200000000,timestamp=2018-03-07T17:14:15.475+0000) > > You dont have to swear to be toxic. The attitude matters too That's all well and good if riot actually took the attitude behind the words into account.. they don't... if i duo'd with an irl mate and he stuffed up a play and i was like lol you're bad or something along those lines the attitude wouldn't matter. It would still be bannable even though we are having a joke with ourselves. So stop.
yCarr (OCE)
: HAHAHAHA JUST GOT A 14 DAY BAN FOR THIS yCarr: so, who we reporting ?? yCarr: gw kalista why do you troll in ranked and not norms yCarr: huh ??? yCarr: stfu yCarr: why do i always get noobs trolls in my promos yCarr: were not going to win this yCarr: troll jungler yCarr: why are you playing ranked?? people are trying to climb honestly yCarr: grats bro kallista jungle does heaps yCarr: im not toxic, this is ranked for a reason people are trying to climb and its people like you who troll pick a jungle and feed w yCarr: ff this isnt winable lets just report this jungle and go next yCarr: 2-6 and you expect to win yCarr: im not helping you, you lost us the game with your trol pick yCarr: report me for what iv done nothing but speak the truth while you have inted, i havent done anything for us to lose this game KALISTA JUNGLE 0-5 BEFORE 10 MINS APPRENTLY UNSPORTSMANLIKE OH WELL GUESS PEOPLE CAN TROLL AND IT DOESNT MATTER BUT SOME BM WARRENTS A BAN TIME GO BUY ANOTHER SMURF RIPERINO
Yeah bro... you didnt even swear or nothing.. thats a fucking joke...ask for it to be lifted.
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
Ninox (OCE)
: >maybe the automated system should be there for normal and the tribunal for ranked.. The point was tribunal was ineffective, and while the automated system leaves a lot to be desired, it isn't trying to falsely ban people left and right. How would you feel if you got banned for that 2/8 Jax game? You're saying you've never gone 1/10 entirely unintentionally? >in my experience anyway. People *do* get punished for gameplay offences, be it by manual or automated review. There are a few recent posts here of people who have been, and that's even with the understanding that someone who has intent fed, knows exactly what they did wrong and aren't anywhere near as likely to come to boards to contest or mention it. Personally I feel the automated system could be tuned a little harsher, and that better communication and more transparency on Riot's part would be a really good idea, but that doesn't mean I think the system does nothing. Mostly I just think it's too slow. >Also that last part is a really stupid thing to say... the way you have written that it sounds like you just think i think that their are like 40 riot employees in a room Then why say something like "Maybe riot is more focused on pumping out the next line of skins rather than looking at a decent player experience."? it implies that you believe more skins = less other stuff, when that just isn't the case and apparently isn't what you believe either. >we don't hear much on OCE? you realize we are not china? Much of the specific information is found deep in comment threads on NA or EU boards, not posted on a front page somewhere that's easy to find, so unless you are frequenting NA or EU boards, which I can guarantee you the vast majority of OCE isn't, you won't find that information. I speak from experience when I say most of it won't even come up in a google search unless you get *really* specific. So yes, there is a lot of information we miss out on here on OCE. >but hopefully this issue can be addressed again the the future It's always being addressed to some degree, and I'd rather what we have than nothing at all, but I do agree it isn't anywhere near as effective as anyone would like.
I never said ban people after one game did i? What i said was i think its an issue a player can go like 8 games in a row inting then decide that they will try and they simply wont get punished for those games because the system is to slow.. in regards to the tribunal being ineffective, i would like to think people could appeal their ban and for it to be manually looked at.. regardless of however long it takes.. it better than being permmed by a bot and riot not even looking at your case. And no... it doesn't mean that at all... it means i simply think that riot emphasizes work on skins a lot more than they do pretty much everything else... with the amount of skins that are thrown in your face when you login lately and how little information is coming out about the actual game itself.. i think that's a fair comment. especially from the outside looking in.. maybe if riot were a bit more transparent it would be different. I literally type in exactly i want into google regarding a league problem and yes usually the question or answer is on an EU or EUW forum.. it isn't exactly difficult to find...
Ninox (OCE)
: I wouldn't be surprised if more effort was put into chat systems, simply because chat negativity is much more prevalent, but these issues don't exist for a lack of effort, but more of a lack of an efficient solution. Manual reviews are effective at distinguishing intentional behaviours from otherwise but they aren't sustainable at scale, no company is going to be able to afford enough people to look at *every single reported game*. It's just not possible. Tribunal was an attempt at a human solution, but players overwhelmingly punished too harshly and required *more* manual review and oversight rather than less. It only takes a quick look at boards to see people who think losing lane early and being 1/4 means you're intentionally feeding (an extreme of course). The scale-able solution, the automated system, can identify and punish obvious behaviours (remember that what's obvious to a computer which sees stats is going to be different from what is obvious to a human who sees actions) but under a lot of circumstances it isn't confident enough to punish off one or two offences so as to prevent punishment of players just having a bad game or who are new. It's all well and good to say "it should be better" but it's a lot easier said than done. The best thing you can do is to help the automated system learn properly through detailed and accurate reporting, and in the meantime send through any reports that aren't being addressed by the system to support so they can be addressed there. Also, the Player Behaviour teams and the Skins teams are completely separate (completely different skill sets) so more skins doesn't mean less PB work and visa versa. We don't hear much here on OCE since we're a small server, and Riot historically haven't been the best with communication (though much better than some other companies we could mention), but that doesn't mean nothing is being done/worked on.
[removed] You gotta admit... shit like this cant go on..
Ninox (OCE)
: I wouldn't be surprised if more effort was put into chat systems, simply because chat negativity is much more prevalent, but these issues don't exist for a lack of effort, but more of a lack of an efficient solution. Manual reviews are effective at distinguishing intentional behaviours from otherwise but they aren't sustainable at scale, no company is going to be able to afford enough people to look at *every single reported game*. It's just not possible. Tribunal was an attempt at a human solution, but players overwhelmingly punished too harshly and required *more* manual review and oversight rather than less. It only takes a quick look at boards to see people who think losing lane early and being 1/4 means you're intentionally feeding (an extreme of course). The scale-able solution, the automated system, can identify and punish obvious behaviours (remember that what's obvious to a computer which sees stats is going to be different from what is obvious to a human who sees actions) but under a lot of circumstances it isn't confident enough to punish off one or two offences so as to prevent punishment of players just having a bad game or who are new. It's all well and good to say "it should be better" but it's a lot easier said than done. The best thing you can do is to help the automated system learn properly through detailed and accurate reporting, and in the meantime send through any reports that aren't being addressed by the system to support so they can be addressed there. Also, the Player Behaviour teams and the Skins teams are completely separate (completely different skill sets) so more skins doesn't mean less PB work and visa versa. We don't hear much here on OCE since we're a small server, and Riot historically haven't been the best with communication (though much better than some other companies we could mention), but that doesn't mean nothing is being done/worked on.
That's all well and good But if this is literally the best possible solution right now i'd be highly surprised... maybe the automated system should be there for normal and the tribunal for ranked.. would give a reason for people to try in what is supposed to be a competitive environment because it seems like riot have gone actual punishments for intent feeding to really nothing at all.. in my experience anyway. Also that last part is a really stupid thing to say... the way you have written that it sounds like you just think i think that their are like 40 riot employees in a room and they all work on the same thing... like give me some credit lol... and like what? we don't hear much on OCE? you realize we are not china? we don't only just have to look on the oce forums for information regarding league changes and updates.. (NA forums, Reddit, twitter, Facebook, ect... like i'm not sure what your role is.. like are you riots version of Sean spicer? (hopefully u get that reference) fair play i think riot does more than a few other companies but hopefully this issue can be addressed again the the future as its not the best experience for a player to attempt to climb the ranked ladder, spend 15 mins in champ select, only to then pretty much sit at your base because its 5/30 by 14 mins because someone decided they wanted to make you lose or just simply int because they can get away it more or less.
Ninox (OCE)
: **tl;dr** Gameplay offences take longer to be punished and the system needs to improve there, but that doesn't and shouldn't mean legitimately negative chat is going to stop being punished in the mean time. ___ Gameplay takes longer to punish than chat does, largely because of the ambiguity involved there. The automated system has evolved to a point where it can pretty dang accurately determine what text is negative and what isn't, especially in the extremes so it's alot less reliant on manual reviews and manual oversight to punish, but gameplay is a little trickier. It's easy to draw the line between someone saying "dang I'm stupid" and "you're f%%%ing stupid [champion]", but intent feeding and having a bad game, or just being a bad player in general? They can both have the same scores, same items, similar paths, but one is a result of a conscious effort to feed and the other is a player not knowing what the hell is going on, or playing like they're 10/0 when they're 0/10. Don't misunderstand, I'm not saying the case you're referencing isn't intent feeding, and I'm not saying toxic gameplay doesn't get punished, simply that it takes longer to punish to avoid punishing a whole lot of innocent players along the way. It also depends on what kind of intent feeding. If they're being sneaky about it, it's obviously going to take longer, where some people (there was a post a few days ago in fact) get punished for their first offence (though usually this only occurs when a history of negative behaviour is involved).
Okay that's all well in good but lets be clear i never said that negative chat shouldn't be punished, or that either all things should be punished or none at all, i'm simply saying it seems that a lot more effort has gone into the chat part of the system and little has gone into the intent feeding side.. for example pretty much all summoners know things that will warrant a ban and things that wont, that seems pretty clear across the board and you're gonna get banned for them.. end of story.. with intent feeding its all over the place when it comes to consistency as you mentioned above someone got punished for their first offence yes negative behavior may of been involved also but still there are people out there who run it down mid in every 8/10 games or for another example i had a brand who said he would feed when his adc died in lane and he did just that regardless if he could get out or not.. he would just run in and die also. I'm glad you agree that the system needs to improve and i think we all know riot has the resources to have more consistency when it comes to people intent feeding.. and perhaps a quicker response time on determining a punishment, i don't think a person should be able to feed (and when i say feed i don't mean 5/8/5 i mean 0/13/2) lets say 8 games in a row then decide oh nah i'm gonna start trying now and then not be punished for those games. Unfortunately i have not seen any posts or any suggestions from riot that they are even looking at improving the system. Maybe riot is more focused on pumping out the next line of skins rather than looking at a decent player experience.
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Ninox (OCE)
: Preseason doesn't change too much, but trolling is still not on. Vast majority of players will drop at least a division or two next season, but yes, raising or lowering your MMR significantly can have a decent impact on that.
Wish the majority of people understood this, Instead of thinking that riot is gonna save their accounts when preseason comes.
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LegendOfswords

Level 153 (OCE)
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