: None of them better come back. It's such a kick in the face to people with them.
Most people who have them no longer play league, and so it's a mute point. The few that do _(and who actually even still play the skins)_ will feel slightly miffed sure. But it's that tiny tiny group of people, or the 8+ million people who play every day. > It's such a kick in the face to people with them. Also, how is it so painful? You'd have to be a bit of a prick to deny someone else enjoying something for a champ they love, just so you can feel special about having it _(especially if you don't even use the skin or that champ)_. So quite frankly, if that's the only reason why we shouldn't bring the skins back, then I say fuck em. Why should we reward that kind of behaviour? I think everyone should be free to use any skin for any champ they want. Thats why I despise legacy/limited content, in any game. If people want to look the way they want to in-game, then let them. It doesn't make me have any less fun. _(and I have a lot more limited content than most players)_ I have absolutely no time at all for people who willingly try to deny other people happiness, just so they can feel special about themselves. That's the core of all limited content. _______ I can accept borders, a small flair to show that a player participated in X event. But denying whole skins forever to 8+ million people? Thats just sad. Having a border gives the d*ck measurers the flex they want, without denying everyone else a chance to use the skin.
Rioter Comments
: The difference i'm pointing out for the most part is that a bunch of the melee champions that go mid have some way of actually picking up the CS more easily with their autos, and don't have as much of an excuse for stuffing up the CS. And for your list outside of Annie Q a lot of these cost large amounts of mana that can't always be used just for it or are only for select autos, so aren't always a benefit you can count on.
: Kassadin W gives you a bonus damage passively, same with Kayle E. Generally speaking you'll find that these champions with passive damages just CS better because it's the same as having some extra AD to farm with.
Mages get it too though, Karthus' Q, Lux's passive, Zoe/Neeko AA enhancers, Twisted Fate's W/E, Ziggs's passive, Annie's Q, etc. Its not like most mages are unarmed when it comes to last hitting. So theres not a lot of excuse, in the early game, Kayle's E is pretty much the only thing she CAN farm with, Kassadin isn't too different. If they even try to use their regular AA's they'll be poked into oblivion.
: "(maybe as a mid mage player, you'll notice that Zed and Yasuo etc often end up with more farm than your range wave-clear mage)" To be slightly fair on the mage player in these scenarios, Zed and Yasuo both do have easy ways to get CS (Zed has his Execute and is AD, Yasuo can Q the minion without autoing and is also AD) when compared to mages who struggle due to the fact that they potentially lack the AD to get the CS. Pressure or no, these champions will always have the advantage in getting CS.
Yeah, you're not wrong at all there. And I must admit Yasuo can CS abominably well for someone who can also pick up kills easily. But it's not just those champs. I notice I CS better when playing Kassadin or Kayle, because you focus so much harder. But yes, you are correct.
: How do I lane against ranged champions with melee champions
JasonWazza has some good advice there. Ill just add what I can to it. Ironically, I often find melee champions end up with more farm than ranged ones _(maybe as a mid mage player, you'll notice that Zed and Yasuo etc often end up with more farm than your range wave-clear mage)_. This is due to your change in focus as a melee champion. When you're ranged, you know you have the 'advantage' over a melee, so you try to press that advantage by harassing them, you're splitting your focus between farming, living, and harassing. While all they are focusing on is last hitting minions and staying alive in between. Ive often put myself behind in gold trying to press my range advantage on a melee champ. Kled is maybe the one champion in the game who shouldn't do this though xD Kled thrives by just going in, and staying in! Unfortunately Teemo's blind completely counters Kled's engages. So Kled is well and truly at a disadvantage here. In this situation like JasonWazza said, accept that lane is a loss, and focus on other aspects of the game. Shift your focus to just not dying. If your jungler is in a position to help, you can try an engage, and that should at very least give you some farming time while Teemo goes back. But your bets bet is to use your amazing roam potential to help other lanes. Whenever your ult is up, come down into mid, or B and run it down bot lane _(they'll never see it coming down there)_. If you're going to try roaming a lot, id just do your normal build. But if you cant, and are forced to stay in lane, an early Adaptive Help will be a godsend against Teemo! ________________________ In the more general melee vs ranged situation, It's a mental game. They have the physical advantage, so you have to have the mental one. Look for openings, people with advantages tend to try to press them, if you put your focus on just staying alive _(which means missing farm every now and then)_, they will get frustrated when they aren't getting anything for their efforts, and they'll start to try harder to get you, and when they start doing this, they will make a mistake! That's your time to strike. Then that frustrates them even further. Nothing tilts a person faster than being killed by the champion you should counter. If you're a Nasus, and you manage to go 3/0 on a Teemo, he's gone for the rest of the game, mentally most people just don't recover from that. Especially seeming he probably picked Teemo just to counter Nasus. Just work on giving them absolutely nothing! They may have the CS advantage, but thats not enough for most people, the blood is in the water and they want those kills. They will start taking risks, and that's when they die.
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
: >Obviously I can see the logic in this, but unfortunately it's an idealistic view, in reality it doesn't usually work well. Ultimately, boards is a vocal minorty, even the bigger boards like NA. Hell, even Reddit doesn't account for a substantial chunk of the population that plays League. Such places are congregations of the passionate players, and while these groups are very important, they aren't the be-all and end-all. This applies to basically everything. The people that speak out on things are the ones that care the most. The quiet majority won't always agree, or care enough to do anything about it even if they do, and we need the help of that majority to make change. In the meantime, every little bit helps. If every person who sees it as an issue just says "well if other people aren't going to do anything, I might as well not" then nothing will *ever* change. Large-scale change is slow, that is the reality, but ultimately change does happen.
> If every person who sees it as an issue just says "well if other people aren't going to do anything, I might as well not" then nothing will ever change. Yeah. That is the heart of the issue right there. But there will always be those people, there is nothing anyone can do to stop that. No one wants to suffer for nothing. and unless theres a certainty _(or a least a reasonable chance)_, you won't get enough people to stand strong. As it stands currently, no one even _knows_ if other players ARE boycotting content or not. It's not like a miner's strike, where those who give in have to to duck stones being thrown at them on the way to work. Apart from the small community on the boards or reddit, no one knows if other players are unhappy, let alone willing to strike. So why would you strike, under those conditions? You'd be a fool. Evidently I am, because: I boycotted prestige Akali _(the one prestige skin that I was seriously interested in)_, because of how 'special' they said Kai'sa was, and then literally the next week they bring out another one. And look how that protest worked out for me... Theres a new 'super fantastic ultra-rare' prestige skin practically every patch, and now I don't have the one skin I would have actually used. I achieved nothing, and now miss out because of it until the end of time. Do I regret boycotting it? Yes. Quite frankly I do. I do regret it, but I still haven't purchased a single prestige skin since. I like to think i'm pretty steadfast with these things, but I have absolutely no doubt that as soon as they release a skin for Air/Sol/Taliyah/Swain/Kindred etc. I'll abandon my morals and jump through whatever hoops they tell me to, as many times as they want. So if they can make someone as outspoken as me, their puppet with a snap of the fingers, what real hope do we have that enough of the community will (a. even bother to strike in the first place. or (b. not share the same weakness as me? The people who say _"well if other people aren't going to do anything, I might as well not"_, are absolutely right. We might hate them for it, but ultimately, (and unfortunately), those are the people who win in the end. When no meaningful changes happens in time, and the rest of us go without. > Large-scale change is slow, that is the reality, but ultimately change does happen. Yes of course, I agree with this. _(which is why I still generally avoid prestige skins)_. But League isn't the ocean, or gender inequality, or gun laws. League has a limited lifespan, and if change doesn't occur quick enough, who knows when breaking point might hit. Like JasonWazza said, it happens to so many games. Pokemon Go, for Honour, No man's Sky etc. Change didn't happen quick enough, and all of a sudden, the games go from being the biggest thing, to a ghost town. I like league, it's taken some bad turns over the last year or so, but I still really like it as a game. And I'd like to avoid it taking that road. So Riot are going to have to not just _follow_ the desires of the community, they're going to have to predict it and get ahead of it. If change takes too long, there may no longer be 'desires of the community' to follow. Personally they have to be quicker to react. These 'eternals' were a good example of them reacting to the community, how much of that was pre-planned I don't know, but it's still good. The price change was pretty token really, but it's something at least. ________________________ Contrary to the content of this post, I'm not just doom-mongering here. I don't think league will ever die overnight. But (from my perspective at least) it's been on a downward path this past year, with rushed short term balance changes, being unable to buy anything meaningful in the shop without loot boxes or large paywalls, and of course these non stop obligatory events. And for a game I like so much, it's panful to see.
: I mean, microtransactions themselves make me feel a bit squirmy, but I do acknowledge that a free to play, online game has to sustain itself somehow. I can't say I particularly care for the direction they've taken, but ultimately we speak with our wallets. Either other people who will pay will support the game for us, or the money starts to run out and they turn things around or risk far worse. I'm still happy to support with a skin for my main here and there, and I won't deny falling for the allure of a loot box pack or two back when they first came out, but there are some methods of moneymaking I just won't subscribe to. Though I think we agree that the *why* isn't the problem so much as the *how*.
I'm fine with micro-transactions, but the thing is, they aren't 'micro' anymore. It's close to $60 when a new skin bundle comes out these days _(that's like buying an Assassin's creed game right off the bat)_, and if you're a main for that champ you HAVE to fork out that money because they don't sell the components separately like they used to, and in a week or two, some of those components will never return. > ultimately we speak with our wallets Obviously I can see the logic in this, but unfortunately it's an idealistic view, in reality it doesn't usually work well. Theres always someone willing to spend the $$$, and theres always enough of those people to continue fuelling the products. People have been voting with their wallets for decades, and the forests are still being cut down for palm oil, animals are still being battery farmed in tiny cages, the oceans are gathering more and more plastic. Theres always people willing to do it, and therefore the rest of us just suffer without the products and ultimately nothing changes. And when something does change, it's like the eternals for league, they lower the price by double digit RP, give us a couple of days of BE sales for the shit tier ones only, and now they're in the clear because they 'listened to the community'.
: oh no, I do not like free stuff, oh no, oh my, they are physically controlling my hand to play in event modes, oh no
> oh no, I do not like free stuff What free stuff? The free stuff you purchase with tokens earned from a pass that you have to pay for? Or the 1 free Border or Chroma that you earn with the tokens you get from missions, that you can only use on a skin _you have to pay for_? Riot is a company not a charity, they don't just hand out free stuff willy nilly, everything is a business strategy _(or else it wouldn't exist)_. You can't fault them for that. But we can fault them for _how_ they do that. > they are physically controlling my hand to play in event modes No one said anything about 'physically', not sure where you got that from. 'Psychologically' perhaps is closer to the mark. Because they do pressure you to play: Say you're an Irelia main, or a 1-trick even. If you don't get that prestige skin now, you will never, NEVER have it with that border included, the same with the normal PROJECT: skin. Once the event is over, that's it, no more. _**Forever**_. You'll go the rest of your life knowing that you'll never ever be able to complete your Irelia collection, it doesn't matter how much you play, or what rank you are. Nothing you could do, will ever bring those limited things back. Thats a fair bit of pressure for someone who is invested in the game, particularly those who play champions who receive event only limited content. If you don't play Irelia, or don't care about loading screen flairs. Then you're a lucky man. But a lot of people do play Irelia, and a lot of people do care about loading screen flairs. _(why else do people grind out ranked for that gold+ border?)_ So yes, in that way, they do psychologically pressure you into playing the game.
Rioter Comments
HeartVine (OCE)
: I firmly agree with this. Season 5 was the last time I regularly enjoyed LoL, which I just can't do anymore, and while a lot of that may be the botched Quinn rework that occurred at the end of that year, there's also been a lot of balance changes (and a *lot* of client-based changes) that have made the game much harder to enjoy (and particularly consistently). Personally, my most hated change is Cho'Gath, and his stupid infinitely-scaling-true-damage-execute-1k+ ult. A single ability which is ridiculously strong at it's lowest power, which gains more strength as Cho stacks defensive stats and uses it, with no cap to it's power whatsoever, meaning that squishies really don't stand a chance (can't remember how many times I've been 2k+ hit insta-killed by a Cho, while I had 2+ health items as an ADC/APC, but I know it's too much)...
Yeah, the sad thing is that this year and much of last year, I really really haven't been enjoying league. I play because it's the only game that all of my friends share, and being in Japan its one of the only ways I can keep in touch with them on a regular basis. _(also I've spent so much money on the game that I cant really afford to leave)_. But regularly when the squad says 'lets hop on league' I groan inside. With all the events and grinds league is pumping out recently. The game feels like an obligation rather than a fun pastime. It has its moments of course, and I love the champs I play. But in general, I don't play for the enjoyment of playing anymore. _(but I do enjoy TFT, that's been a godsend)_ Yeah Cho'Gath is a menace. I particularly hate his Q because as if the knockup and massive damage wasn't enough, you also are slowed for a massive amount afterwards. Which just feels so unnecessary. My most hated changes are probably anything that gets reverted afterwards. Like Zac/Kog/LB etc. Because it just shows that no real thought went into their reworks, they were done quickly to appease the current state of the meta at the time, and then get reverted leaving the champ in a weird place. It sucks for people who play those champs, _(and sucks again once they learn the new one, and then it changes back again)._ Either you make a change and commit to it like Poppy and Sion etc. Or you don't fuck what doesn't need to be fucked with.
: Who decided Panth was a good idea?
As someone who has been playing the new Pantheon a lot. I both agree and disagree with your points here. First, Pantheon's shield is far more akin to Xin's ult, than Yasuo's windwall. It doesn't actually _block_ anything, it makes him damage immune. So any abilities that would pass through him and hit multiple targets still do so, unlike the windwall. Also he can still be CCed. The problem I have with the shield is how it treats what direction the damage is coming from. It reads the direction of the _source_ of the damage, rather than the direction of the damage itself. For example, if Ahri is facing the shield and throws her ball out, the damage of the ball will of course be negated on the way out, **BUT** will also be negated on its return as well, even though the damage is striking Pantheon from behind. Meanwhile a Heimerdinger turret attacking Pantheon from behind will damage him, _(because the turret is the source)_. This leads to strange interactions like Karthus's ult being negated, _(assuming the shield is facing towards wherever Karthus is on the map)_, when that damage doesn't come from any particular direction. My other problem with the shield, is that he can cancel it. This is a big no no in my books. Any champion _(not just Pantheon)_ should have to commit when they use an ability. If you have an ability like this that is very very strong for defence, you should have some trade-off when you use it, and the trade off here should be that once cast, you have to wait out the whole duration before you can return to pumping out damage again. You shouldn't be able to cancel the ability imo. _________________________ In lane, I think he is a bit oppressive, but in the game at large his Damage/CD/Mana is moderately balanced _(compared to some)_. The main problem in lane, is the safety of his all-in engages. When at full passive stacks he can jump on you, stab you with Q while you're stunned, then switch to shield and take no retaliation damage from you, which puts his stacks to full again, so he can back off as soon as the shield finishes, and stab you with an empowered Q while retreating. So he is only vulnerable in the split second it takes him to dash, and in the moment it takes him to stab you with the empowered Q as he backs off. That isn't enough time to employ any meaningful counterplay. But he does have to focus, he doesn't have enough 'bonus AoE damage' like Zed does, that just happens to kill people around the target as well as the target itself. He has to choose a target, and direct all his abilities towards that target. So if pantheon isn't attacking you specifically, you are usually relatively safe. The same cannot be said of the champs like Zed or Twitch or Illaoi etc. Who do enough passive damage around the target, that you get caught up in it. Which means that while powerful, Pantheon doesn't impact the game as a whole as much as these champs that go in and pick up 'accidental' triple kills. He's a good 1v1 duelist, but cant wade into fights cleaving people left right and centre, as he is forced to prioritise. __________________________ Is he a bit stronger than he needs to be? Yes, personally I think so. Is he as bad as some of the champs that already exist and have done so in their current form for a long time? No.
: Personally after having played a few league games (and not playing more or less for a year), i'd prefer if we went to seasons past where it was possible to stand in a lane without just randomly being burst by 1 random ability.
Yeah I agree. The damage and movement creep has just reached a point where any mistake at all means death. There was a point somewhere in season 4 or 5 I think, where everything was _(relatively_) balanced, more so than now at least. I don't think that's just me being nostalgic either, I genuinely remember a spot where everything was pretty good.
Nightjar (OCE)
: Gangplank isn't a bruiser, he's somewhere between fighter, duelist and mage, and uses %armour shred on his barrels to decimate teamfights. Gangplank isn't tanky. Rumble is an AoE damage mage, and whilst he is of a similar design to mundo, Rumble is closer to a mage/bruiser than a tank/bruiser. Olaf is very similar to mundo, and builds similarly, although Olaf has the option to go for more damage and lifesteal, and has complete CC immunity on his ult, whereas Mundo has tenacity and stacking magic resist. Full build Olaf tends to go for steraks and black cleaver as his damage items items, whereas full build mundo typically only goes titanic hydra. This is largely because mundo lacks scaling ratios and is more based around hybrid %hp damage. It's for this reason that Olaf tends to be better in sidelane split against duelists than Mundo. Trundle typically goes 1 damage item (generally triforce or Bork) into full tank as well, and into the right teamcomps, Ulting Trundle is so much harder to deal with than Mundo. Trundle is also slightly better at sidelane 1v1s. Mundo's primary tankiness comes from healing and magic resist. Against ad duelists, %shred, and grievous wound items, Mundo can be countered fairly reliably, and whilst less susceptible to CC than some, Mundo is still peelable. Tahm Kench is a tank bruiser, and thus doesn't need to build damage either. Kench is designed to be good at 1v1s, he's better at it than mundo and olaf, though worse than Trundle. Other than that, Kench is able to protect an adc but does a poor job engaging fights, and is far more kitable or peelable in teamfights than Olaf or Mundo. Mundo also doesn't actually gain more damage with items, so bruisers who invest in a small amount of both magic resist and armour, will be better suited to fighting him, than squishies. If you want to focus down a Mundo, %hp shred and grevious wounds tends to make quick work out of the regenerating lump of hp.
Yeah I know gangplank isn't tanky, that's the point I'm making. Anyway, I think we have to agree to disagree. I don't like the 'unkillable juggernaut' playstyle. I don't care if the stats are balanced or not, I think it's not fun for people to play against, and that defeats the whole purpose of the game. I think the game should be based around compromise and strategic building/playing. In my mind, having no hard CC is not an equivalent trade for being un-killable with the high damage he has. He still has a big slow, and a very very high movement speed, so most champions cant escape him, or kill him before he can kill them. Im not saying mundo is 'brokenly op' or anything, i'm not even really talking about Mundo in particular. But I don't think building full tank but still doing lots of damage (in any capacity), is a healthy thing for the game and people's enjoyment of it.
Nightjar (OCE)
: Some champions are designed around base damage. Mundo doesn't have cc, he does damage in it's place, and his kit is designed to be a zone bruiser. Zone bruisers are designed to do enough damage to force players to disengage or focus them down. It wouldn't be very effective if they had to invest in damage to achieve this. If we were talking about a Alistair doing crazy damage output with 1 damage item, I'd agree, but Mundo has been designed to 'exchange CC for damage'. Also sunfire cape was designed to make tanks a relevant persistant damage threat for 1v1s or simply to augment base damage to give them ways to play against mages and adcs who misplay or misposition.
You can't just 'focus down' a Mundo. > Mundo has been designed to 'exchange CC for damage'. What about other fighters like Gangplank, Olaf, Rumble, Trundle, etc. They sacrifice hard CC for damage too, but they don't get to be almost un-killable. Olaf is a perfect example of a 'bruiser' champ (using your definition), he either frightens players away forcing them to disengage, or forcing them to focus him. He's got fairly high damage, and is moderately tanky. He builds a mix of damage and tanky items. Thats how I think it should be. By charging at you Olaf puts himself at risk too, his ult has a trade off, he does his job, but he has to play it right, or else he dies. Mundo has no risk. Theres not a lot you can do to him, you cant kill him (certainly not alone), if you CC him he can catch right back up again because of his permanent slow and movement speed (he's difficult to kite for the same reason). You're stuck. And we aren't just talking about Mundo here, take Kench for example, he doesn't lack CC but still deals stupid damage for the number of tank items he builds.
Nightjar (OCE)
: mundo has 1cc, it's not even very good. It's a mediocre slow. Take away his damage and he doesn't do anything. Literally doesn't do anything except provide a mediocre slow. I think a fundemental misunderstanding you have here is the difference between 'Bruisers' and 'Tanks'. Bruisers like Darius, Garen, Mundo, Olaf, Volibear, ect... are not tanks. They can be tanky, but what fundementally differentiates them from true tanks is a lack of peel and engage abilities. They don't have the same ability to protect an adc, or start a teamfight or make a pick, and their lategame plans often revolve around splitpushing because of this. In a lategame teamfight, a maokai is far more useful than a darius, because maokai will survive longer, and whilst doing less damage, will be more disruptive with the vast amount of cc they can provide. A tank can easily lockdown an assassin trying to dive an adc or mage, making them easy to kill. A bruiser more or less has to try to kill the assassin after the adc dies, because they don't have ways to protect them. In alot of game scenarios, an assassin suiciding to eliminate 1 or more backline carries, is more than enough to win the game. A tank can initiate a teamfight well, using a variety of large CC engages and has survivability tools at their disposal that will prevent them from dying in short return. In exchange they don't do much damage, often relying on mediocre base damages or %hp damage or sunfire cape to create some pressure. A bruiser has to run at enemies, and hope they don't have the cc to peel them off and lock them down, or the kiting skills necessary to wear them down before they get into damage range. God forbid they have an ashe or a zilean, ever tried to play a darius or nasus in a lategame teamfight into a zilean? You're going to spend the next few minutes moving the slowest you've ever moved, and the only incidental damage you might deal may be a thornmail before you die. Bruisers do have upside though. They're very snowbally, and are designed to take great advantage with gold and xp leads, through higher base damage, dueling mechanics and generally greater base stats. They trade off the CC and engage of tanks, in exchange for dueling power and damage, making them difficult to deal with in sidelanes splitpushing without a coordinated collapse. Bruisers are designed to take a lead, run with it, and predetate on a team's lack of coordination and game knowledge, making them potent in low elos. Alot of players don't know how to play defensively, so it's easier for a Bruiser to get out of hand, for enemies to start feeding and have a considerable item lead, and use that to end the game before others can scale. Bruisers primarily bring to teamfights, dueling potential and damage. They also tend to have tools to allow them to pressure a zone. Olaf for instance creates a zone due to the potential for his ult to mitigate attempts to peel him. In teamfighting scenarios, this creates a crux where a team can focus the olaf to quickly resolve him at the expense of cooldowns which would be disadvantageous in the ensuing teamfight, or concede the position, disengage through the use of mobility, again surendering cooldowns, and allowing the enemy team an advantage such as dragon control or a tower. A bruiser's kit relies on having the balance of tankiness and damage, that would allow them to create this zone of pressure and kill threat. It should be fairly obvious that a Xerath would not like to be in melee range with a Darius. Even if the darius has 1 damage and 5 tank items, and the Xerath has opted for 6 damage items. There's nothing inherently wrong with bruisers, they fulfill a role in the game. They aren't just another form of tanks like you keep suggesting. Taking away their damage would make them less viable than they already currently are. They're a combination of tank and duelist, that are designed to be potent zoning tools. ---------------------- Basically, you need to learn and improve. Bruisers aren't the problem. They have counterplay, they're just unfortunately a role designed to capatilise off mistakes, much like assassins. They're currently underwhelming at higher tiers of play, and nowhere near as oppressive as they were in season 2. In the time honoured words of all gamers: Git Gud.
You have talked about almost everything except the 1 point I'm trying to make: _"If you want a balance of survivability and damage, you should have to build a balance of damage and tank items."_ E.g. Builds like {{item:3065}} {{item:3068}} {{item:3083}} {{item:3742}} {{item:3071}} {{item:3111}} shouldn't provide champs like Mundo with the crazy damage output they do. Im not talking about the definition of a tank, or bruiser mechanics. I'm saying that _if you don't build any damage items, you shouldn't be doing a lot of damage._ If you want to be a Bruiser, fine, but you should have to find the right balance between damage and survivability. Not just build all tanky items and 1 half damage half health item and still cut swathes through the enemy.
: TFT - most BS RNG system
**Play to your strengths** RNG isn't everything in TFT, far from it. Certainly it's a factor, and you can just get unlucky of course. But the main skill in TFT is playing to the strengths of what you get, knowing when to cut your losses, and knowing when to commit to a certain build. You might want an imperial/blademaster team, a Draven with Rageblade, bloodthirster etc. But if you keep getting defensive items and few blademasters, then at some point you have to make a decision, and maybe sell your Draven and take that Braum that keeps popping up. Or else you might keep drawing a blank until you're out. People keep saying _"I don't get what I want, but the enemy always does."_ No. Thats not the case, the enemy probably isn't getting what they want either, they just know when to let go of what they want, and play to the strengths of what the game is actually giving them. I like going for Glacial, get Braum to lvl 2 and give him a Thornmail, aim for that lvl 3 Ashe and a rageblade. When I get it, it's amazing. But sometimes (most of the time) the game just won't give me the components, in that case, I have to explore the other classes the glacial champions I already own have. Are kindred and Varus popping up a lot? Time to sell that Lissandra and aim for the ranger bonus for your Ashe. Maybe I want that rageblade and I have the needlessly large rods lying around for it, but I'm starting to lose and theres no guarantee that the recurve bows will appear, so maybe its time to sell Ashe, turn the rods into a deathcap slap it on Liss/Anivia and head for that Elementalist bonus. The game will always give you something. It may not be what you want, but you'll always get something. What separates the good strategists from the bad, is how they use what they are given, and how flexible they are to changing tack mid game. ____________________________________ **Always Re-assess!** It's RNG, which means you'll always get exactly what you want.. _eventually_. But we don't have until 'eventually' we have about 20-40 minutes, so you have to constantly re-assess your army: Maybe you've got that Knight bonus going, a lvl 2 Morde and Garen, it's getting into later game now, and karthus pops up. Do you switch out your lvl 2 Garen and Knight bonus for a lvl 1 Karthus and Phantom bonus? Its late game, Garen is less likely to show up now, but Karthus might well come round in the shared draft, so theres a chance at a lvl 2 gold champ. If you do take Karthus, can you swap out some of the rest of your team to get sorcerer going too? All of a sudden, in 1 round, you've gone from maybe a Knight-Bruiser team to a Phantom-Sorcerer one. Maybe it's worth it? Maybe not? What does the enemy team have? If they're running assassins, you've probably just fucked yourself. If they're running Yordles, maybe you've just turned the tables. These are the decisions you need to make every time you get something significant in a round. Every time you get an item. Every time 2 or even 3 of the same champ pop up in the store. Every time the shared draft comes around. Every time an enemy makes a big change to their team. Re-assess the situation, and consider your options. ____________________________________ **Positioning** You also can't under-estimate the power of positioning. If you're getting champs who don't move. Maybe the way you've positioned your team blocks them in once people start moving _(although sometimes there are bugs where they are in the open and still do nothing)._ If you want to change the focus of your team, you can do that by splitting them up, put the bulk of your team closer to the enemy, but place the flankers in the corner under where their carries are. Once the game starts the enemy team will move to the closest threat and your flankers will automatically close in on the rear because of their location and because they take longer to get to the fight. ____________________________________ **Luck** So yea, RNG is a factor. But it's what you do with what the RNG gives you that counts. if you're having problems **_"a good 95% of games"_**, well.. the common factor in all those games is you. The 'R' in RNG stands for 'Random', which means its not intentionally spiting you, the chance of getting _literally nothing that works together_, while everyone else gets _perfects rolls_ in 95% of games, is so astronomically small, that either you're the single most unlucky player in history _(to the point where scientists need to study you)_, or the RNG is not _actually_ your issue here. Regular 5v5 games have a hell of a lot of randomness to them as well. Which team does the game put the 3,000,000 mastery point Vayne on? Which team gets the Top lane Janna that AFKs at 15 minutes when the team wont surrender after she feeds Nasus. Need to ward a bush? Maybe it's empty. Maybe the enemy Rengar just happens to be there? Unless you can somehow keep the entire map warded, there's always luck involved. Are you first pick? Last pick? Is your champ banned/picked? Did the last tick of their ignite kill you? Did the last tick of your ignite leave them on 6 HP? TFT just doesn't hide the innate luck of gaming. It tells you exactly where the luck comes into play, and in my mind, thats much better. You can plan and allow for that. _**TFT is essentially rolling dice and looking for patterns. There are always patterns, you just have to look for them.**_
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
: When did they turn Zac's ult back to 4 bounce please? (instead of aoe catch)
Patch 9.11 https://na.leagueoflegends.com/en/news/game-updates/patch/patch-911-notes
TheBioB (OCE)
: The Next PvE game mode!
Odyssey was fantastic! IMO easily the best event related game mode hands down. It was fun, hectic, challenging, and united players together in a way that other game modes can't do. Star Guardian was alright, it was fun at the time but is essentially just an Odyssey beta though. The first ever Doom Bots was amazing! absolutely amazing. Everything since, has been crap. 'The Teemoing' just felt hollow and ultimately pointless. I miss the 50 minute long super-turtling that you did to survive (and win) the onslaught of the original doombots. Seeing the creative teams people concocted (did you build a full turtle squad, or 'kill them before they kill us' all assassins team etc.) If Riot can make them without sacrificing other aspects of the game (such as TFT), then I see no problem with bringing them back and making new ones.
: Patch 9.16 notes
No Little Legends? Thats a bit disappointing.
: RP
What Seras said. Not all money from different countries is worth the same. It'd be lovely if the price where I live was 5円 to get 500 RP. But I doubt Riot would approve of practically giving the stuff away. AUD isn't worth the same as USD. and it isn't fair to have a lower price of RP in one country just to match up with their currency. I do think RP is over priced, however I'm still buying the stuff, so that must say something..
: I think it's more they've changed their expectation of players. Not that League was ever really a "collect everything" type of game, but they've pretty much focused on the "larger and flashier collections for specific champions" people rather than the "collect a bit of everything" crowd. The decision I can respect, even if I prefer the "collect a bit of everything" model. It's more reliable both for player expectation and for Riot. The method of doing so...well, let's just say it leaves something to be desired in my books.
Yeah I see what you mean. My main issue with it is the "right place, right time" aspect. I'd be fine with the grinds if next year you got a chance to pick up the things you didn't get this time around. But that isn't the case, theres so much limited edition crap that if you think you might ever show an interest in that particular champion, you have to pick it up now, or else you could fall in love with that champion in the future, and NEVER have the cool extras for them. Imagine a new player starting league in October, they pick up Akali, absolutely love her, she's the best character in any game for them, they get 1,000,000 mastery points on her. But they always encounter people in game with the PROJECT: Border and chroma, or Prestige KDA Akali with the border, and they know they can NEVER, EVER, have those things, for the champ they love. Just because they started playing league at the wrong time (or for some reason couldn't play during the event). That saddens me. I'd hate for there to be an Aurelion Sol skin or border etc that I could never obtain, because I just so happened to be on holiday when it popped up. Like you mentioned, It's also really biased towards 1-tricks. If you're a Pyke 1-trick, you do one event, and spend like $60 and you're set for life. But if you're someone like me who has a wide selection of champs that I play relatively evenly. _(and then on top of that, a few very special ones like Azir/Sol/Swain/Tal etc.)_ It's just too much, almost every event has something. Why should people be punished for playing more of the game?
: Project event?
Yeah, the game mode was actually really fun. If you're going to disrespect us enough to give us back to back grinds, why not at least offer us interesting ways of earning tokens? _(seeming we cant play TFT either if we want to complete the missions)._
: Why are these events appearing back to back?
Clearly respect for the players has gone right out the window! Who actually has the time to put life on hold for two months to grind out these tokens? Events should be fun, not an obligation. People should want them, not dread them. Give us a break. I haven't played other games for a month, and I still had to purchase a token bundle to reach the goal. I can't, (and won't) do it this time round.
: > Thats all I need to survive right? Food/water, shelter, warm clothes, etc. **Anything else is just unnecessary vanity right**? What do you mean by anything else? If those are accessories, decorations and the like; Are you asking for those pretty trinkets free of charge, and the least amount endeavor as possible? If the acquisition of such items are NOT defended by a tall wall called effort. Then it cease to become meaningful, people would be inclined to not pay anything. After all, why pay for something so easily obtain; The face value of such an item would be common and cheap. Not a worthy display. You are comparing complains about a hard to obtain item with reasonable value, to cheap 3-5$ goods that is in abundance. Are you making a case that, those things the OP have asked for should be reduce down to that level of accessibility? > People want to be individuals, they want to express themselves in the way they want to. Some people do it through clothing, some people do it through makeup, some people do it through digital avatars. It's all 'unnecessary vanity'. But clearly it's something that humanity is drawn to, or else we wouldn't have been making 'unnecessary' things like art, music and nicer clothing, for thousands of years. Yes, and they spend money to have access to these splurges. The key word here is MONEY. Without an economy that reward talent with riches, our society would not be prosperous. Just as the game has provided you with 2 choices. You can BUY using the money you've worked for. Or, you can obtain them using the hours playing game. Either way, you are spending those hours of your life as payment. It's up to you to decide which of the 2 is more effective. > The people who do live in a world with nothing but the necessities, are usually called prisoners, and it's supposed to be a punishment. Man, you are comparing a case of situational destitute to people playing game, and complaining about the pretty little pixels that is too hard to get. You can't even put them in the same light. One is EXTREMELY DIRE, and the other is greed.
Hey, I'm not going to get heated over this, a lot of what you said just then doesn't seem to relate to what I said, so I'm not going to go into that. All I'm saying is: What you said previously reads as _"it wasn't a predatory business model because the things it's selling are just 'wants', not 'requirements'."_ I'm just adding a counter argument to that, by saying that 90% of what we all buy are just 'wants' not 'requirements'. Gambling/Alcahol etc are 'wants' not 'needs' but would you call that a non-predatory industry? Riot knows people want these things, and they know how to make them pay lots of money to get it. That seems predatory to me. Yes we all have a choice. But thats what predatory strategies do, they put a lot of pressure on people to make the choice the company wants.
: I don't know if you guys are able to differentiate between need, and want. These things are what you fancy. Not a requirement. They don't affect game play, it is but a vanity decoration. > predatory business model Would be contents that are more to the side of pay to win. Like Gacha type games; Where pulling for super rare and powerful characters affect game play.
> These things are what you fancy. Not a requirement. They don't affect game play, it is but a vanity decoration. Well, I don't know about you of course, but personally, I don't live in a bland grey box, or eat the same standard meals every day. My wardrobe doesn't have rows and rows of nothing but grey jumpsuits. Thats all I need to survive right? Food/water, shelter, warm clothes, etc. Anything else is just unnecessary vanity right? I don't neeeeed that shirt, but I like Green Lantern, and i'm happy to spend an extra $5 to have a Green Lantern shirt instead of a plain grey one. I don't neeeeed the new Hawaiian McDonald's burger, but i'm happy to spend $3 to eat that for a change, instead of plain boiled potatoes. I don't neeeeed to watch TV, or play games, or wear different colour underpants every now and then. But I do. And I assume, you do as well. _____________________ I spend a lot more time playing league than I do staring at the little picture of a boat on the wall. So if I'm looking at league for 4+ hours a day, what's wrong with making it look a little nicer? I am after all, spending a LARGE chunk of the day in that space. What do you think is money better spent? New looks and effects for the champions I play literally every single day for hours and hours. Or the little picture of a boat I see for 15 seconds when I hop out of the shower? People want to be individuals, they want to express themselves in the way they want to. Some people do it through clothing, some people do it through makeup, some people do it through digital avatars. It's all 'unnecessary vanity'. But clearly it's something that humanity is drawn to, or else we wouldn't have been making 'unnecessary' things like art, music and nicer clothing, for thousands of years. So drawing on an inner desire that mankind has had for all of recorded history, does seem like a pretty solid business model to me. _____________________ The people who do live in a world with nothing but the necessities, are usually called prisoners, and it's supposed to be a punishment.
: Prestige Edition Skin / Event Token Change
I work a job with normal hours, and while these grinds are on, I spend every available moment grinding out league for these points. I stop playing all other games I usually play, go to bed late, eat quick food, and I've only ever achieved the skin once _(and that was the first time with Kai'Sa, and even then I bought some tokens to make up the difference)_. So how they expect normal people to do this completely baffles me. _(and they expect you to have fun while doing it too...)_ Prestige skins in general, are just a joke in my opinion. But I need the points in-case they bring out a skin for a champ I'm emotionally invested in.
: It was just a reskin, lets be real, Riot are the king of doing nothing while pretending they are doing things. Just looking at the edited in pic shows that, not only is it that your ally is the one getting a kill and an assist, but he is also dealing 891 magic damage when you only recieved 591 magic damage. This isn't a bug, this is literally something coded like utter crap, when it's numbers don't even add up properly, just like the old death recap.
: It still has the same bugs of your own teammate contributing to your death. It's a somewhat prettier version of the same garbage.
I mean, it's fair enough that there's going to be some bugs. It's a computer program. Of course it isn't going to be spot on perfect ALL the time, at least not on release. But for it to fail so utterly and completely, at the one _single thing_ it was designed to do... Like really?... It makes me wonder what they have been doing all this time? {{sticker:zombie-brand-mindblown}}
Rioter Comments
: Patch 9.14 notes
Why is {{champion:64}}'s new voice over not mentioned in the patch notes? It's definitely live. _(RIP Vic. Clearly 'innocent until proven guilty' has no weighting here)_
Booka (OCE)
: The death of Tahm Kench
Personally, I think they stray from the path with any changes that nerf his supporting capability in favor of balancing his top-lane bruiser life. Coming to a standstill when nerfing allies, killed like 70% of the cool plays he could make as a support. (My friend plays kench, and I play Sol. I’d extend my stars then he’d eat me and run under tower. The tower targets me because it’s my stars doing the damage, but it can’t fire because I’m inside kench.) That’s an extreme example (that probably shouldn’t occur anyway) but you get the idea. He’s basically a containment unit now, he pauses the fight for you, but doesn’t save you from it. If you ask me, just kill all his damage, and make him great at what he was meant to be: A support that excels in pulling people from the fire. There are plenty of cool top laners with neat kits. Why take away a cool support to add to the already large roster of top lane juggernauts? It doesn’t make sense to me. I think the stun consuming stacks is fair enough. It’s a LONG time of being useless when he can both stun AND eat you. But I’m not a kench player, so I can’t comment too much on how this affects him. I am a fan of him being able to devour red and blue though. It’s no more troll than Syndra’s ability, and I’ve often seen cool plays make by her stealing it and throwing it into her own team. Anything that encourages interesting and unique plays, that require some thought/planning, should be encouraged imo.
: How to influence other lanes with lead without falling behind
**Mid lane:** I'm a mid laner, so I have more experience here than in jungle, but I'll do my best to answer both as best I can. I play a lot of roaming champions to help with this issue. Like Aurelion Sol, and Taliyah. Because these champs have kits that allow them to roam so quickly, there's a lot less time wasted. Running Teleport also is an option so you're able to return to your own lane quickly _(although personally I prefer other spells)_. Talking the water-walking rune can be extremely helpful when you're placing an emphasis on roaming too. All these things just help reduce the time you spend not doing anything (ie walking between lanes). So you can maintain your lead while assisting other lanes. Also, I recommend roaming bot over top _(if the situation allows)_, theres just more to be gained, and the champions are often less slippery too. Often I will roam bot, even if we dont get any kills, Ill stay just help with pushing the tower instead of going straight back mid. If they're not doing well in lane. Ending the lane can be a big stressor gone for the whole team. **Jungle:** Obviously ganking is a great help, but you can't be in all places at once. So if a lane isn't doing so hot, or is getting ganked a lot. Get a control ward and use it and your trinkets in the surrounding area. Prioritising scuttle near lanes that you expect to be ganked (or expect to tank yourself). Giving buffs to laners is always helpful if you're ahead and don't need it. Perhaps give the buff to a lane that is doing well, so you don't have to worry about them as much, and can focus your efforts on other lanes that need you more. **Champ picks:** Picking the right champions can be a huge boon for aiding the team. If you're confident in your own skill, its easy to pick carry champs and go off and start wrecking by yourself. But often theres not a lot Yi or Zed can actually do to help other players _(usually you just end up starving them of kills and compounding the issue)_. Picking roaming champs is good, or champs like Shen/Panth/GP/Karthus who can respond quickly to problems in other lanes. Most Karthus' save their ults for kills, but if you use it mid fight, or even at the beginning, it is a huge morale boost to your team, and a massive stressor for the enemy. You won't get the glory of the kill, but it often helps a lot more than trying to snipe kills _(also it's more efficient for damage output)._
Ornn (OCE)
: bit it isns't a lie majority of legitimatre OCE players noy tranfers are sick of their games ruined by these people that go unpunished i do didagree with it just being Chinese but its mainly people from indoneasia and imigrants into our country
1. It is a lie, that's not really up for debate. The word _**"Whole"**_ was used. Therefore the statement is false, making it, a lie. 2. You say _**"majority"**_. How do you know this? Because of a few posts on a forum? Your cause doesn't even have a majority on the boards, let alone the whole region. Show me proof that the 'majority' of OCE league players support this. If you're not making statistics up, it shouldn't be a problem. 3. **_"legitimate OCE players"_** What makes someone a 'legitimate' OCE player? Either they play on the OCE server or they don't. If they do 'play' on 'OCE', by definition, that makes them an 'OCE player'. 4. _**"that go unpunished"**_ Please show me proof that all these people 'running it down mid' don't get punished. If they are doing this as often as claimed, and people are reporting them, I don't see why they wouldn't receive punishment the way all the rest of us do. 5. _**"immigrants into our country"**_ Once again, proof please. But I'll pose the same question I did to OP, what do you want done about it? Should people seeking a new life for themselves in another country be banned from playing league in that country? I currently live in Japan, should I be banned from playing on the Japanese server because I'm not a national? People in this thread are happy to moan about their 'problem', but don't put forth any solution. Perhaps that's because they know that any solution that appeases them, would be outright discriminatory, and unacceptable. If that's the case, then what's the point even bringing it up?
: Rek'Sai
Rek'Sai is in a strange place in my opinion. I think a lot of the problems I have playing her stem from the fact that so much of her time is locked up in animations. It takes ages to change states between burrowing and unburrowing. Also, compare her tunnelling to someone like Lee Or Yasuo. Theirs happens instantly, hers goes through a lengthy bumbling animation. Her ult is just straight up weird, it has a strange amount of time of doing nothing for an effect that doesn't actually achieve a lot. Apparently it's dodge-able _(but I've never managed to achieve that feat)_. It's just a confusing ability. Her old ult was much more strategic and useful. Also, she's been in the game for a long time, and I still don't quite know what she's meant to be. Her kit is definitely based around damage. But she isn't bursty (or smooth) enough, to compete with proper Assassins. She's not squishy, but she's definitely not a tank. Nor does she have the in-battle sustain to be on the same level with the juggernaut bruisers like Darius or Volibear. She's great in the jungle, but _(at least to me)_ seems to fall short in most other places. I don't really know what she needs. I think considering the pace most games are played at now, _(with most champs who matter in this meta, achieving near permanent 500+ MS, and little-to-no cast times)_ she needs to be made smoother, and not spend 1/3rd of her time stuck between attacks and in animations.
: Chinese rampancy needs to be dealt with - ASAP
> This is a request from the _**whole**_ of the Oceanic community that play League of Legends. I am a part of the Oceanic Community, and I made no such request. When the first line of your statement is a blatant lie, why should anything that comes after be taken seriously? > This needs to stop. And it needs to stop now. What is your solution? Shall we submit a DNA test upon account creation? Or perhaps sit a language Exam, to make sure we don't know any other language than English? What exactly do you want to happen? I'm curious here. > filled with Chinese players It's also filled with Australian players, and in terms of sheer numbers, I'd hazard a guess that there are more Australian/NZ players causing problems than players of any other specific demographic. I can tell you, I've been flamed at a lot lot lot lot LOT more in English than I have in any other language. So from my perspective, it's the English speaking players that are the problem. Maybe we should look at us before targeting anyone else. Or better yet, just treat bad behaviour as bad behaviour regardless of who does it.
72 sins (OCE)
: Damn thnx man, i never thought about that and your comment put everything in a different perspective. Ill try out playing a lot of champions and see who i like, just like you said. Thnx again!
No worries mate! League is a game, and the aim of all games is to have fun. So just have fun, and everything else will follow. I play Azir, and I think he's really difficult _(but we all think that about our own champs)_, so I have a chip on my shoulder about that. But I also play Swain, and he's not difficult _(the dude practically plays himself)_. I play them because I love them, I don't need any other reason. It took me 20 games to stop feeding as Azir, _(let alone get a positive score)_, but I enjoyed playing him so It didn't matter. If I had to force myself through that if I didn't enjoy the champ. My league days would have ended long ago. So just have fun with it, see where the ride takes you. Who knows, the champ you click with might not have even come out yet. So just take your time. {{sticker:slayer-pantheon-thumbs}}
72 sins (OCE)
: Most mechanically intense champion?
People here are talking about skillcaps, but "Mechanically intense" doesn't necessarily mean "difficult". For example, Lee Sin and LeBlanc, are _mechanically_ complex, but that by no means makes them difficult. They require a lot of button pushing it's true, but essentially function around a set number of core combos, playing them is mostly just your fingers memorising the right order to press buttons. Once you've practiced the combos enough, you can play them blindfolded. Meanwhile champs like Aurelion Sol, are mechanically simple, but much more difficult to play. 80% of Sol's damage comes from 1 ability, and that ability is either on or off. His other abilities are for the most-part just _'press the button and a bunch of cosmic fire comes spewing out'_ not a lot to it really. Sol's difficulty comes from having to always be watching, thinking about, and predicting EVERYTHING! Once someone gets close to you, that's it, you're gone, no buts. If you don't have an eye on literally everything thats happening in a fight, you'll find yourself trapped in with a Talon or a Yi, and your jig is up. Unlike Lee and LB with all their dashes and invisibility and shields, Sol has no training wheels, you make a mistake, thats a grey screen for you. You have to predict everyone's movements including your own, and put yourself in the right position at exactly the right time. Know when to go in, know when to get out, you have to know all the other champs and what they can do, and how fast/slow they can get to you. Moral of the story: Things aren't always as they seem. And theres no 1 solution. ___________________________ But tbh, if you're new, don't go looking for high mechanics champs. In fact, don't go looking for any kind of champs yet. Just try out the champs on free rotation each week, give each one a proper go. When you get enough BE, buy champs you are interested in. If you wanna be a wind samurai then buy Yasuo, if you want to set shit on fire then buy Brand. Eventually you'll find two things; you'll find a champ you love, and you'll find out what kind of champs you enjoy playing. Once you know that, nothing else matters, difficulty/mechanics/etc. it doesn't matter. You're far more likely to succeed playing someone you love and are interested in and by sticking with them through thick and thin, than you are playing whatever happens to be 'meta' that week. Or whoever has more mechanically difficult abilities. Just have fun, and everything else will follow.
Rioter Comments
: TFT added to ARCADE Event Pass
> TFT doesn't grant progress toward the pass's five milestone missions. Why?
y3215 (OCE)
: Just confirmed, thx for that!
Rioter Comments
Mindstar (OCE)
: Thanks for asking this - its a really valuable topic as we want you to feel like you can fully engage with new mode, and especially its content, without something in the back of your mind about _what if..._ We're pretty damn excited for it too! The short answer to your question is - we have every intention that TFT will be around to stay. If players don't like it and don't engage with TFT, and for whatever reason it doesn't work out, then our intention is to do right by players that have spent money on the mode. The focus thus far has been very much on bringing this out though, and I really hope that if it's your kind of thing, that you'll have fun with it :) https://imgur.com/abbQCs4
Thanks for answering this. After you posted this I went and bought some eggs worry free ^^ Thanks for that I am loving the mode! I'm sure it'll be successful.
: guys...is it me or TFT is so luck based?
Yea. It's a luck based game. It's supposed to be. It's not exactly supposed to be testing your mechanical skill or anything.. Theres enough different strategies with combining class traits and items, champ choice and positioning, but there is a lot of luck. I don't really see a problem with that. Aren't pretty much all card and/or board games luck of the draw?
: True, but calling Blitz a battle royale would be misleading. Battle Royal was just one of the mini modes. I think a deck builder type deal would be a good way to approach adding more champs, since you can't have too many individual units for a game like this. The struggle is finding meaningful ways to add the content elsewhere without compromising visuals, clarity, etc. I think something like the clash flags (which need to appear as you get to lane or before not in the middle of farming thank you very much) would be a good opportunity to bring them at least to the rift. I can't see them adding them elsewhere so long as TFT succeeds though. Time will tell I suppose.
I can't remember where I saw it (maybe one of the older posts about TFT) but it was said that they'd sit on the sidelines of summoners rift and cheer you on. But it's one of those things where Ill believe it when i see it. Yeah, it'd be cool if there were some champs that could only be gotten through RNG, but others that you could work towards through many games and add to your deck. I guess we will just see how TFT evolves. I think it will stay, and one of the main factors is because when you win you get a good feeling. But when you lose, you don't really feel down. _(who knew RNG could feel good?)_. Unlike regular league when if you win well you wanna play again, and sometimes when you lose badly, you wanna find a hole and go cry in it. TFT has more ups than downs, _(especially seeming if you get smashed, you can leave the game and don't spend the next half an hour trying not to be a burden to your team.)_ So for those reasons I think (and hope) it'll stay. Like you say though, time will tell.
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Lord Sesshomaru

Level 10 (OCE)
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